If you read the lesser sites you found out what I told you was coming two weeks ago….My source was spot on right down to the congressman who authored the legislation.
The FSC who said the LA County law wasn’t enforceable because it should be done by the state is now backpedaling faster than Lance Armstrong. The bill has a long way before it becomes law and it might even face a tougher time than the LA Law did.
A few things you can bet on though James Lee won’t be back to fight it and the FSC will be begging for money so they can once again prove how ineffective they are….
They are using the same tired arguments that cost them the ballot last time, waste of money, porners will leave itll hurt the local economy blah blah. News flash there Diane….the rest of California could give a fuck about the LA county porn economy which by the way….last I checked….REQUIRES CONDOMS.
Just Sayin
Be pass more useless gun control or make porn stars wear condoms. California congressman do not give fuck about California rights as people as much as care about looking like there doing some thing safe gaurd them with stuff like House Bill AB332. FSC gone be as useless as tits on bull at fighting House Bill AB332. If any one need proof this all one needs remember how badly they lost fight in La County over this. There fact Diane Dukes sugar daddy Manwin are not gone be round give FSC there pocket book.
All I can say is: porn brought this on itself. The industry was pretty much left alone as long as it played nice. If it had focused on raising its profile with pretty girls, the way that Jenna Jameson and Tera Patrick did, it may have gotten more mainstream legitimacy. Instead, porn raised its profile by pushing the envelope, with one site after another trying to be more outrageous than the competition and with acts that I contend put talent at considerable health risks. Double anal, fisting, ass-to-mouth, bondage, etc. The industry likes to argue that being a porn performer is the same as being a stunt person – you go into the business and accept the risk. The difference is that a stunt professional is trained. No one comes into the stunt world and falls 60 feet off a building to a padded landing on day one. You learn your craft. Show me the 18 year old – or the porn director – who has truly been trained to do a DP. Yet, girls who are fresh off the bus do these kinds of things on day one.
These guys are all street tuffs who think a fight with the legislature is street brawl that will be won by them because they have more tattoos. This is the big leagues. In the words of John Mellenkamp: I fought the law and the law won.
Ok. I’m sick of the bullshit on this site. When are people like Mike, BT, and richard373 going to stop criticizing and start DEFENDING this Industry? Yeah, the adult industry made mistakes but the majority of people (even performers) still prefer the lax regulatory climate. And enough with the bullshit that condom sex is just as sexy as bareback. The health of the performer should always be #1–but not at the cost of the statewide censorship and the balkanization of the American porn industry as we know it.
Mike South, you say you are a defender of porn but all you do is trash people who are honest enough to admit to loving porn and take a stand to fight unreasonable regulation.
What are you going to do?
“Ok. I’m sick of the bullshit on this site. ”
SOLUTION: Don’t read it.
Why should anyone defend the industry if the industry does not want to protect the health of their bread and butter! The talent are not mandingos forced to fight to the death for entertainment sake! If the companies would have said “okay, ya got us! we’ll start using condoms, sorry”… Then things would be just fine. Instead, they said, “Hey, they’re our property and we’ll do with them as we please”. That was insulting to ME! You’d better understand that, coward behind a mask known as origen01. Who are you. Come out and show yourself, please.
Fortunately for porn the California legislature is one big clusterfuck that makes it just about impossible to pass anything other than bills that make the legislator’s Cadillac payments, pay for junkets to Thailand complete with trannies fucking them up the ass bareback and/or spend the state into even more debt. I doubt this will pass on the first try but if this asswipe keeps pushing the bill and manages to attach it to a must-pass budgetary bill he just might eventually get what he wants. I think it will take a long time (talking about 5-10 years) before the legislators in general have balls enough to even attempt to pass such asinine legislation but as AHF overfunds candidates that are amenable to such travesties (costing them literally billions of dollars) this could eventually come to pass. I hope the AHF goes bankrupt trying to get amenable legislators into office and fails in their mission and that Michael Weinfuck gets HIV from those gay hookers he likely fucks on a regular basis (no man or woman would be able to stand him day in and day out because he is such an asswipe fuckhead cocksucking asshole).
mharris, you are wrong. The term JUST FREAKING STARTED. This would very likely pass quickly. The Democrats are in full control of Sacramento and are open to influence from left-leaning interest groups. Like you said, all they need to do is tack this on to some omnibus piece of legislation and it’s “game over”. Defense of poprn isn’t exactly a poison pill…
Not to mention AHF is also prepping the signatures for a Statewide Ballot Proposition. The recent victory with Measure B gives the momentum to AHF and the prognosis does not look good if people give up their right to defend free speech.
A statewide anti-condom law would not only effect California but could also impact obscenity prosecutions nationwide as the bounds of what is considered decent in regards to sexual acts would be constrained (both due to a contraction of bareback content supply and a consideration of the regulatory precedent).
A lot is at fucking stake. This is not a game. Whether you like the FSC or not the adult industry is in real danger. It’s time to man up and choose a side.
excuse me, I meant regulating porn isn’t exactly a poison pill…
I chose sides a long time ago — and it isn’t Weinfuck, that is for fucking sure! I have also seen how the CA legislature works. It took three years to pass the prison reform bills that were forced on them by a Federal Judge for crying out loud. If it took them that long to keep themselves out of jail for contempt of court (for not immediately passing the necessary legislation — they were lucky they weren’t rounded up and jailed after 60 days or so) they won’t act quickly on Measure B part deux, that is for damn sure. Jail terms aren’t hanging over the legislators heads like they were for the prison reform legislation.
Mharris, with all due respect, it is exactly your type of reaction and thinkingthat resulted in Measure B passing by a large margin. “Costing them literally BILLIONS of dollars.” That funny.
Statements like this might make you a hero in the adult industry, but they accomplish nothing in the real world, actually they do just the opposite. This legislation, and the campaign contributions that will come to a number of legislators who will co-sponsor the bill, will pass much sooner than you think. And in the process several industry myths, like a 14billion ds will be proven to be as dollar industry, and 10,000 jobs will be proven to be as phony as Dianne Dukes ability to run the FSC.
But you were right about one thing. Bills that come with perks get passed very easily. And the campaign contributions that will be coming from the big dollar contributors to AHF wil certainly push this bill right through the legislature. It will be fun to watch the twitter and facebook campaign the adult indutry puts up, just like their failed Measure B campaign. The adult industry had ever major newspaper, the requblican party, and every major buissiness group behind them and they still couldnt win. Did you learn nothing. And yesterdays statement from Dianne Duke contained the exact same loosing argument they put forth or Measure B.
So go on calling them cock sucking trannies, and wishing AIDS upon them. I think you are just showing your frustration because you know you’re going to lose again.
Sorry, jilted, the real loser is you–(not personally). NOBODY wants this piece of legislation. You’re going to be enforcing a piece of legislation that interferes with individual Americans’ sex lives and does NOTHING to promote safety in the adult industry. Instead the massive decentralization that is currently underway is UNDERMINING performer safety.
mharris, the only to stop the bill is to let it drown in the Fiscal Committee. Advocates need to get to work and DEFEND THEMSELVES AT THE DAMN HEARINGS. If it makes it out of committee, we are fucked because it can be tacked on to anything. Unlike the prison reform bills of the past, the bill is only TWO SECTIONS long and does not have wide-reaching and polarizing consequences. Also, as I mentioned before, regulating porn is not a poison pill–unlike being “soft” on prisoners.
Again, this only part of the battle. AHF is still prepping signatures of a Statewide Ballot Initiative…
oh and mharris, it’s not you who needs to choose a side. I was mostly referring to Mike South…
Jilted has made you resort to name calling, which means you have no real argument! Like a three year old you start lashing out! Result of this debate? Jilted wins, hands down. Now please go back to LIB where you obviously belong.
Nick, you don’t know me but people that do realize that I have a very crude sense of humor (which is part of what attracts me to adult) and speak my mind. For the record I rarely post on LIB, preferring to post here and at TRPWL as well as ADT (where about once a year a mod gets offended from something I post). I am just sick and tired of people that think porn performers aren’t capable of deciding for themselves whether to use a condom or not. People are smarter than you and Weinfuck seem to let on, it should be their decision whether to use a condom or not — not Weinfuck’s, not yours and not a nanny government’s. We have freedom of expression in the US Constitution and it is high time that nanny idiots like LA City Hall and Weinfuck realize it!
Interferes with individual Americans sex lives? lol! We’re talking about tax paying professionals doing a job in front of cameras and lights and having all kinds of infectious bacteria slathered all over and inside their bodies for entertainment. Where do you come up with these ridiculous comments, origen? And does NOTHING to promote safety? How do you even say that? Please go back to LIB where you belong!
Origen,
Nobocy wants this bill? LOL tell that to the 80% of constituants in Mr Halls district that voted in faovor of measure b.
Maybe you can enlighten us all origen01 and tell us exactly what the porn industry does regarding health and safety, as Dianned Duke put it “the EXHAUSTIVE measures already in place.” I have ssen these types of statements before but nobody ever expands on them and tells us what those measures are. Would you like to take a shot at it? I dont think having performers pay for their own tests, and doing nothing about hepatits, or hpv can be called exhaustive. Plese origen01, enlighten us.
Origen01,
My last post seemed a little sharp. I dont want to start a internet war here on Mikes site. To be fair I have seen you write many things that I agree with. So to dull the sharp edge of the last post I will ask that anybody who can shed some light on what the industry does about health and safety please give us that information.
My apologies for appearing to make a personal attack.
Ok Origen, explain to me what FSC has done for the porn industry or the porn performers? One must realize that there are some in the industry that are destroying it from the inside out. Criticizing FSC and the industry and bringing various important issues to their attention seems to be the only affective way to get things done. FSC and the industry have been perfectly happy doing nothing about these issues. This appears to be the main reason there in this mess in the first place, which Mike South reported a long time ago. He had a call to arms on this very issue and was ignored by the people it would affect. Those who had the power to do something about this issue early on chose to do nothing. Origen, I live in Arizona and my opinion on this probably means nothing to those in California. I don’t speak for Mike on this issue and this is strictly my thoughts on the matter.
Richard, you can criticize the FSC all you want…I don’t give a fuck…I don’t like the organization much either (or their organizational platform) but the fact is they have done more to defend the adult industry than you ever have. All you guys do is shit on people who are trying to defend the right to make adult films against serious opposition.
When are going to start posting some thoughts towards a solution?
jilted, I strongly believe in performers who want to use condoms. I agree with Mike that performers who want to use condoms should be able to do so without financial repercussion. That being said, the only real way to achieve a decent standard of performer safety is though unionization and a return to centralized testing. The effects of Measure B has been disastrous. Many Industry folks are now shooting underground in Vegas. It’s only a matter of time before a criminal incident occurs or another health crisis.
Origen, I find it funny and sad that you can’t even explain what good FSC has done for the porn industry and its performers. Here is something you do not seem to understand. Several people have offered common sense solutions but Diane Dukes did not respond. Now the FSC is battling California with same old tired argument that lost them Los Angeles County. What have you done on this matter, Origen? Have you contacted anybody in the State Capitol to explain your displeasure with this bill?? Enlighten me on your solution to resolve this matter.
Someone mentioned unionization below and I have seen this mentioned on LIB. Unionization may ultimately be a good thing for performers, if you can get porn talent to unionize. However, if your concern is the ability to work without condoms, at the end of the day, a real union that is the porn equivalent to mainstream unions, is likely to have the opposite impact because unions become focused on the health and safety of their constituents – the performers. It does nothing to address the real threat, which is OSHA. If Cal-OSHA begins looking at condoms as a workplace safety issue, you don’t need statewide legislation. Finally, if producers are worried about the additional costs of compliance, just wait until they see the cost of dealing with unionized talent. I say this as someone with experience as a longtime, card carrying union member of the writer’s guild of america, east. Here’s why.
First, the union establishes the minimum that a producer must pay for a specific scope of work and the terms under which payment must be made, including a percentage of the fee in advance of the work performed. A producer can pay more than the minimum and an actor or writer with clout can demand more favorable payment terms than the standard contract, but a producer cannot pay less than the minimum. Those fees are not generally set to benefit the producer.
Producers must contribute an amount equal to 18% of the fee to the union pension fund on behalf of the performer. There are health insurance contributions. And, there are union dues. That $1,000 anal scene, now becomes $150 upon agreeing to the scene; $300 when the performer shows up on set and goes into make up; $650 upon the completion of the scene; and an additional $180 to $300 in health, pension and union contributions.
Unionization will probably mean residuals – a performer gets a small payment every time a scene is viewed, just like actors and music performers.
Last, and most important, a union performer becomes an employee of the production company during the production period so that withholding taxes are paid. That adds 7.25% to the cost of the scene for the producer. More importantly, it means that the producer is responsible for the health and wellness of the performer as it relates to the production of that scene.
What that means is that porn could no longer use the excuse that you see often: Hey, talent are not our employees and we’re not responsible. They’re independent contractors who know what they’re getting into.
If you want to be treated like mainstream, that’s great. But mainstream could not conduct business the way that porn conducts business.
richard, like it or not the FSC is the only organization out there in negotiation with Cal-OSHA on behalf of the adult industry. If you think they are thoroughly incompetent and corrupt, start another organization. Meanwhile, I will continue to contribute to the FSC. I criticize them too, sure, and I often email prominent members but I don’t go around spreading apathy when so much needs to be done to protect adult films.
We all want a safe working environment but AHF is going too far.
Wake up.
BT, I think Cal-Osha has given porn a lot of leeway and their current enforcement regime is solely the result of pressure from AHF.
I will address your unionization points soon but I will venture to say that all sorts of baselines can be negotiated through the collective bargaining process…
“Unionization will probably mean residuals – a performer gets a small payment every time a scene is viewed, just like actors and music performers.”
Probably not a bad idea. I have a friend who was paid for 9 films and last I checked there were over 40 on the market. Of course, she was only paid for the 9 films. The industry is only bringing unionization upon itself if it comes – personally I doubt it will happen because of the ‘young, dumb and full of come’ syndrome. There will always be a new batch of girls off the bus in LA who think they can become a star by doing porn. That is why the industry will have to deal with legislation instead.
I guess of they were smart they could have done what Hollywood did and hire the mob to unionize the staff – and then pay off the mob to keep the unions under control… but I suspect that window of opportunity closed long ago
Origen has any one from the FSC replye to any e-mails you post to them?? Has Diane Dukes seen any of your e-mail take any of her owen time replye to them in person?? Has e-mailing any body at FSC change how there fighting this Origen?? I do not live in state this take place infact move from California to Arizona four years ago get way from California issues. Why do you keep contribute FSC when they well not even disclose what they used your contribute for??? Origen I asked you for better solution on this matter did come up with one. Gave solution if live state California so worry about issue call and e-mail your congressman tell him your displeasure about this. If do not live in state California know this they do not give flying fuck about any one opion on this matter but those live in state California. Your right support FSC all you want as my right to criticize them for many thing they failed to do for indusrty people work in it. You need wake up Origen becuase supporting fail FSC only supporting people like AHF who been wiping floor with them on this issue.
FSC standing with Cal-Osha very poor at best. FSC claims they made at last Cal-Osha porn meeting way they been acting at them got indusrty on Cal-Osha shit list. Origen I seen last Cal-Osha meeting where FSC was hair breath being kicked out meeting being ban from all futher Cal-Osha porn indusrty meeting.
Michael Whiteacre and Mark Kernes have responded to my points via email.
richard, you can criticize the FSC all you want. I also criticize them but what is bullshit is that you and other people on this site are almost praying for them to fail. It confuses me. Do you guys support porn or not?
Origen01,
Many would argue that to best support way to support the porn industry is to get rid of the FSC. One need not support the failure that is called the FSC to support porn. The fact that pornographers continue to employ Dianne Duke is half the problem.
The FSC does not represent performers, they never have and never wil. They support producers. There is no organization that represents the rights of performers. Even LATATA does not represent performers, they represent the interests of the agents. Its quite ironic that you have not seen one single statement from LATATA regarding this issue. How could they possible argue that not using condoms for unprotected sex is BETTER for their performers. And dont even use the condoms cause abrasions baloney. The prolonged sexual encounters, with our without condoms, wil cause abraisions, and it only takes a microscopic abrasion for disease to be transmitted. Abraisons happen with or without condoms, sorry Nina, but you look like a fool everytime you make this argument. Nina, you do a great disservice to the industry by making this ridiculous claim. It might make you a hero in the adult industry, but in the real world you are not taken seriously, by anybody.
And ther is no need to pray for the FSC to fail. Failing is the one thing that the FSC does best. And the current situation is all the proof you need of that. James Lee, LOL, need I say more?
From a female point of view, condoms are nortoriously more likely to cause abrasions given the various types of penetration going on. You are also kinda misleading readers when you write about sex for prolonged periods. Performers take breaks…
The FSC absolutely represents the interests of performers. Performers are the main spokespeople for the organization. Why would they support an organization that is painfully screwing them in the ass? (not literally) Granted, much of the FSC platform is geared towards producers and that has to change but, on this issue, have you ever considered the idea that most performers do not like working with condoms? I agree with your point that performers must be protected–hence the reason why I support unionization–but what makes you think AHF is doing performers any good? Also keep in mind that a significant portion of performers produce their own content–whether on their websites or on cam-sites. What is really screwing them in that department? Measure B!
From a female point of view? I have no idea who you’re speaking for MR. but just because you read it doesn’t make it true. Thanks for letting me know about abrasions from various types of penetration. It’s a good thing that I know that now because I was stupidly using a condom for most of the couple of hundred scenes I have shot over the last few years. I shudder thinking that I could have gotten an abrasion because that would have been much worse than syphilis or HIV. An abrasion? I wonder if the stuff they call lube might help with that? Oh, thats right, were to stupid to remember lube. Thanks for that brilliant insight into why I shouldn’t be using condoms. I feel smarter now. An abrasion..really?..that’s the argument to not use condoms here? You would have been better off to come up with something remotely factual or something that is not so easily solvable such as handing the chick a bottle of lube.
Brooke, so you continuously use condoms for your scenes and find no additional discomfort? I’m seriously asking. I’ve heard other performers say that they are more uncomfortable. What kinds of scenes do you do?
I was not speaking on behalf of all women and I am not, nor would I ever, say that no one should use condoms.
I without a doubt continuously use them. Need proof? Feel free to check my site or blog and condoms is 95% of what you will see. To kill the abrasion argument even more I have reactions to latex and have to use the not as pliable polyurethane, which has worked perfectly for years. Not one abrasion, ever. I don’t even recall a broken condom. I also use female condoms and think those totally rocks, but they would be awkward on film. If you want the truth from the girls, sit around with them when they aren’t in the company of a potential paycheck and watch how the table tilts to who wants to wear condoms…you my good sir would up to your ear in condoms. Facts are facts…abrasions…well you get those when you fall off a motorcycle or try to convince the mindless that condoms suck.
I support porn. But what I do not support FSC that more welling pretend doing some thing for porn indusrty yet pats self on back for good job at dismal performances against AHF any other thing fail at. I am not gone tell any one at FSC they did good job becuase they fail. Do you know what definition of insanity is Origen?? It is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. On this matter FSC doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Nice Michael Whiteacre and Mark Kernes respond your e-mails yet they support Diane Dukes vote her in again in be charge FSC. What I am tire of Orginen is watching FSC fail then blame on ever body in inusdrty but them selfs. I am not gone support FSC becuase each time they fail they ask for more money support fail again than ask there supports be happy that they fail.
What could the FSC have done differently to prevent the passage of Measure B? They did all that was in their capacity to stop the initiative from passing!
The FSC is not the NRA. They are not political heavyweights. All they had were the contributions of donors and the message war waged by prominent performers. Instead of supporting their points in the debate, you ridiculed them–not for the failures but for their boldness to defend porn. And you encouraged people to do absolutely NOTHING. Now you wonder why Measure B passed? And you guys want to sit on your asses and do the same thing while AHF makes condom-only porn a statewide (and eventually nationwide) policy. Wake the fuck up…
The medical definition of insanity literally includes the inability of an individual to perceive and comprehend real events occurring in the individual’s surroundings.
California voters do not care about porn inusdrty being made wear condoms. They prove in La county with there votes. They do not care about jobs lost if measure B goes in effect. FSC has been bold about fighting this they did nothing about this when frist happen only starting fighting it when to late stop it. Wake the fuck up realize this Origen FSC does have proven track record with California voters. They well decide if measure B well pass not FSC not you me them. Right now Ahf has better track record with California voters.
FSC care so much about porn performers why did they restate Mr. Marcus back in porn indusrty. After he caused huge syphilis-infection scandal in porn industry. After break ever safty protocol that FSC said would keep porn stars safe from STD Diane Dukes told world he was sorry could go back work. Wow that really looking out for best interests of performers in porn not. FSC made syphilis-infection scandal worst for porn performers give them bad advice on matter with out even consultant doctor see if advice was right give out. Origen after this event real hard see FSC being freind porn performers.
The exhaustive testing does not include testing for Herpes, Tineaversacolar and other easily transmitable skin fungal infections, Hepatitis, HPV, etc. The only “exhaustive” testing done is HIV, gonorrhea, and chylamidia. Oh, and sometimes syphilis. I personally quit because I was tired of catching STD’s and I challenge anyone who says they’ve NEVER caught one and yet is successful to a damned LIE DETECTOR TEST. Why? Because they are LYING. Period. Origen, how many of you FSC bullies are there now? You amaze me with your outright lies, fabrications, and imaginative exaggerations!
First off, richard, we don’t know whether or not Mr Marcus was patient zero. I could have been a Euro performer..
Second, what does Mr. Marcus’ performing schedule look like nowadays? It’s down SIGNIFICANTLY from what it was before the outbreak. What have you seen him in because I’ve seen him in nothing since last summer.
Third, what can the FSC possibly do to prevent Mr Marcus from working? This is entirely the prerogative of the talent agencies and the production studios!
Fourth, everyone makes mistakes. Mr Marcus deeply apologized (even on this site) and all the FSC did was convey such apologies to the public. I wouldn’t exactly say they welcome him back with open arms. He’s still kinda an Industry pariah.
Oh, put a sock in it, Nick East. If you read any of posts on LIB you would see that I am constantly challenging the Industry disease rate and I also criticize the FSC. I fabricate nothing. I agree with you that herpes should be tested but testing for HPV is impractical and testing for Hepatitis and Tineaversacolar or Staph infections is superfluous. I think HPV vaccines should be recommended when a performer makes his/her debut..
What do you think Measure B is doing to the Industry by encouraging underground shooting and motivating performers to engage in prostitution?
Hey origen01, why don’t YOU put a sock in it? I will not go to LIB ever since Cindi (with an i) posted a link to a snuff flick!!! Hell, she doesn’t even ask her readers to be over 18 or show nudity, but she’ll link curious children to horrible snuff flicks? Why anyone visits that site anymore shows more about them than they think. So we agree that the testing is NOT in fact EXHAUSTIVE!!!!! Wow!!! Now, as far as prostitution? THAT HAS NOT CHANGED ONE BIT!!! Who else do you think is willing to get naked and have sex in front of a camera, eh? And another thing… WHO ARE YOU? Stop hiding behind a mask and let us know who you are!
Measure B was necessary to FORCE adult film companies to step up to the plate and protect their EMPLOYEES health! Ef anyone who thinks that adult talent does not deserve the same protections as EVERY OTHER AMERICAN! And ef anyone who thinks that talent currently has a choice in the matter!
and one more thing (while I’m on a rant), TALENT DOESN’T NEED THE COMPANIES ANYMORE!!! That’s right! Internet, webcams, hd cameras on everyones phones!!! If the companies want to treat talent like gladiators forced to fight to the death for entertainment purposes (they make more money that way), then ef them straight to hell!!! Shut the Fuck up, origen01, you sound like Diane Duke, period!
Newsflash, Nick East. If the talent starts producing their own content they are, by definition, producers and Measure B HURTS them.
So you’re saying that if talent start producing their own content, that they will sell less product over the internet using their own cell phones to shoot, their computers to edit (free software), and talent they actually want to work with if they use condoms? What a fairy tale world you wish to create for us, origen! You try to show us porn as loving, caring, soft, wonderful expressions of love and lust and that the natural state is without condoms! Well, that’s bullshit and I’m here to tell it! The truth is that porn was once like that to some extent, but nowadays porn is cum gurgling while being choked by eight guys with jism and piss all over your naked and cold body! Look it up on any of the free sites (which the FSC should be fighting) and tell me you can’t watch crap like that for days on end without watching the same one twice! Poor ole’ Wicked Pictures was doing it RIGHT and now they have to get punished with classes and permits and all of that bs because when CAL/OSHA came to tell the others to tone it down and use condoms, the FSC told them where they could shove it! Blame the FSC for CAL/OSHA coming in strong! Porn performers are people too, and they deserve worker safety, PERIOD!
Hey origen, what about the small group of people who actually get off watching porn because they imagine the girl catching diseases as a way of punishing her for being so naughty in the first place.
And what about STD porn!!! You know, the kind that mr. marcus made? PEOPLE GET OFF ON THAT SHIT!!!!! Gross!
Where do you draw the line on what a performer has to do to earn a living? Imagine how young the girls would be if the companies could get away with it, eh???? We need laws to protect workers from unscrupulous employers, origen (if that is your real name).
One more thing, origen. Who are you? Why do you care? Everyone knows who I am and why I care, so come clean, anonymous person!
“So you’re saying that if talent start producing their own content, that they will sell less product over the internet using their own cell phones to shoot, their computers to edit (free software), and talent they actually want to work with if they use condoms? ”
Um. No. You are putting words into my mouth. Performers are already shooting from home and producing their own content. They should have the option of whether or not they should use condoms. Many have expressed the desire the go without condoms but if they do so they would be in direct violation of Measure B.
“..but nowadays porn is cum gurgling while being choked by eight guys with jism and piss all over your naked and cold body!”
You surely cannot be saying this is standard practice in MOST of the adult industry. If so, leave this site and go blog for Gail Dines.
“Poor ole’ Wicked Pictures was doing it RIGHT and now they have to get punished with classes and permits and all of that bs because when CAL/OSHA came to tell the others to tone it down and use condoms, the FSC told them where they could shove it! Blame the FSC for CAL/OSHA coming in strong! ”
How about I blame the AHF, who was the only party who instigated Measure B, Cal-OSHA, for their burdensome and unreasonable regulation of adult films, and communists like you who want to even punish SAFE and RESPONSIBLE producers and talent just to make themselves feel better.
“Porn performers are people too, and they deserve worker safety, PERIOD!”
They deserve worker safety. Every reasonable person agrees with that. Stop trying to demonize me and oversimplify the issue. The fact of the matter is, Measure B does not eliminate the economic incentive to go bareback and as long as the demand is strong, supply will make up for it. Producers are now shooting underground and things are even more unsafe for performers. How is that doing any good? And what makes even think the majority of performers prefer to use condoms? Most that I have spoken to are against Measure B but strongly feel as if they should always have an option to choose to use condoms.
“Where do you draw the line on what a performer has to do to earn a living? Imagine how young the girls would be if the companies could get away with it, eh???? We need laws to protect workers from unscrupulous employers, origen”
I do not say no. That’s why I strongly support 2257. Sometimes these laws just make sense and sometimes companies need to be “forced” to do the right thing. I think performer unionization would be a better mechanism by which producers would be forced to provide for worker safety. And let’s be clear, the courts have suggested that performers are workers and not independent contractors. Not to mention use of the civil court system for instances of negligence and workers compensation disputes.
But I’m not for being hypocrites and acting like condom-sex is just as appealing as bareback sex because consumers certainly don’t think so. Fuck the consumer? I don’t think that’s a wise business decision nor do I think it’s a reasonable restriction on entertainment. The right to produce and buy bareback films is almost as fundamental as the right to produce and buy all of pornography itself.
Hey folks!!! Now origen says I’m a communist!!!! FSC bullies at their finest!!! Every debate class in the world knows that when you need to start lashing out at your opponent, it’s because you have no plausible argument! Now please either tell me who you are or STFU! By now everyone here knows you are afraid to reveal who you are. Are you a coward, original one? You sure think you’re clever to hide behind your keyboard and spout lie after lie to people who now consider you to have revealed your true intent (misinformation). Love how Brooke got ya on the condom friction comment you made!!!! But I guess we all needed to see just how laughable the argument against using condoms actually is!!! You are helping us make a point! The adult companies do not care about the talent AT ALL, except to have unprotected sex with them with their “currrent AIM test”, which most of them have!!! Look it up, it’s true!!!
Now PLEASE go back to LIB? Stop spouting the same rhetoric over and over and over again.
Okay, Benjamin Franklin! lol!!! “The right to produce and buy bareback films is almost as fundamental as the right to produce and buy all of pornography itself.”
There it is, folks!!! We hereby hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, with the right to humiliate and degrade women ala Max Hardcore style without restriction. That they should never be forced by an unruly congress to be made to sheath their members in latex skin thereby removing the fantasy aspect to the few who care in the first place.
You should be a legislator, origen!!!!!!
lol, I’m afraid to reveal who I am…
Nick, calling you a communist was hyperbole but it’s not that inaccurate as you have stated that even if producers are responsible and safe they should abide by stringent regulation solely because of the reckless actions of other studios. They should be sacrificial lambs for your moral crusade. The lack of respect for the individual is a signature mark of communism and makes you no different from the producers who think performers are nothing but sacks of potatoes.
“There it is, folks!!! We hereby hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, with the right to humiliate and degrade women ala Max Hardcore style without restriction.”
So you think that most of porn degrades women. So why not just ban porn?
There it is folks. An anti-pornography crusader masked as a friend. Talk about wolf in sheep’s clothing.
So now I’m the wolf dressed in sheeps clothing? This just gets better and better, folks! Am I the only one who realizes that the person spouting off known as origen01 is too ashamed of what he’s written to reveal who he or she is? Cowardly to say the least.
Origen? you left out drug crazed, alcoholic, disgruntled, umm, brain damaged, retarded, uh, hypocrite, has been, washed out, loser, prick, asshole, fuck-up, and why didn’t you tell the audience that I eat puppies for breakfast and bathe in baby seals blood?
Come on, anonymous internet bully (working for the FSC), show the folks how much fun you have calling people unfounded names!
“What do you think Measure B is doing to the Industry by encouraging underground shooting and motivating performers to engage in prostitution”
Waitwut?!?!? When did the performers stop those practices. I do believe it was pretty common before Measure B. If a starlet is going to turn tricks she is going to turn tricks (and almost certainly make her john wear a condom whole doing it).
The reason no one can come up with a reasonable argument against condoms in porn is that other than the fact that customers may not want to see condoms in porn – there is none.
Frist never matter if Mr Marcus was patient zero or not he still had syphilis . He mange work with syphilis for long time passing through FSC STD safety protocols for long time before being caught on fact. I do not care how sorry Mr Marcus said was still lie way through FSC STD safety protocols was still allowed work with very syphilis coverd cock untill he was caught. You can dismiss Mr. Marcus all you want be he prove with out doubt that FSC STD safty protocols fail when put true test. Mr. Marcus was mistake he knew he had syphilis lie about keep working in inusdrty was only sorry about when he got caught. FSC done nothing prevent this from happing again.
How is the Mr. Marcus scandal a reflection of failure on behalf of the FSC? Last I checked, Marcus FABRICATED his test results and did not go through an APHSS facility. He went through TTS. How is the fact that he was able to forge his results a reflection of any sort of failure except one one part of TTS and the production studios who failed to perform proper verification of his test results? Now you are just scapegoating…
The FSC put their arms around marcus and even gave him money!!! I know two people who quit working for the FSC because they KNEW diane duke was COVERING UP true infection rates in order to make the industry smell like roses to the outside world. So APHSS is the fox guarding the henhouse, period!
Frist FSC refuse beleave that Mr. Marcus had syphilis when frist report. Infact FSC try say was lie from talent agencies that caught him . Than after FSC had spunk on face over this matter try excuse Mr. Marcus action as common cold which gave out advice for ever one indusrty go get syphilis shots even if they did need them with out advice from there doctor. When FSC realize that stupid idea from people like Mike South who point out them at time did they change mind on that advice. Stead fast fact refusal from FSC to take responsible for owen actions that happen in syphilis-infection scandal. There fact I told Fabian Thylmann this once on this very site I can find all ugley fact about Manwin just buy googling them up. Gues what I can still find all ugley facts about FSC failures on syphilis-infection scandal buy gooling them up to. Speaking of Manwin as recall FSC attack any one at time useing Manwin money that did go along Manwin part that they play syphilis-infection scandal. There fact FSC claim for long time that they have made prevent measure stop what Mr Marcus did do fake owen test long before he did. Yet those measure that Diane Dukes claim work before where proven bad buy Mr Marcus who was male spokes person for FSC. I have yes FSC was very major player in syphilis-infection scandal. The where in that mess from start to end of it. As much Diane Dukes and FSC would like to forgett that event happen there many people in inusdrty out side steal clearly remember it what happen with it.
DWB got this right frist time Orginen if do not like my opion on FSC do not read it. As for why I am gone criticiz FSC gone do so untill stop failing at what they where supposed being doing for porn indusrty. Why do not support FSC I see no clear evidence that there gone win battle with AHF ussing same lame strageties that fail win over voters in Los Angeles. I rest my case move on next subject.
The FSC and the ‘industry’ in general has often said that performer safety is a main priority, but in the very next breath they say they will go “underground” where performers will have less protection.
How can they have it both ways Origen, first say that safety is a priority, then threaten to make things even worse if any of these laws are enforced. How can they claim safety as a priority and then threaten to make things worse? Perhaps you could ask Dianne to explain this. And you are 100% wrong about the FSC representing performers interests. They represent the best interests of the procuders and nobody else.
Origen,
Maybe you could also ask Dianne about the Performer Subsidy Fund, that health insurance for performers, and that “secret plan’ she spoke of a few months ago. And then tell us how well the FSC representation of performers is coming along.
Jilted, you make a good point. The adult industry can’t have it both ways. I fear it will learn this lesson very painfully in the near future. Although this is the case, it does not change the fact that are strong market pressures for bareback porn. Measure B is a prohibitory regulation which really does not eliminate the economic incentive.
And really, is the desire for bareback porn so wrong? This is a natural activity after all. It is not really contingent on the fact that performers are guaranteed to be infected with disease. It is just the responsible behavior of adult producers and performers that should be called into question.
Now I don’t know whether or not I should continue to support the porn industry. The FSC is not really the root of the problem–producers and performers are. A lot of the things you guys are blaming the FSC for is just the inadequacy of the FSC trying to “spin” the rampant unethical behavior of performers and producers.
The problem is that almost everyone in pornography lacks any sort of ethics. I guess many already feel ostracized by society so they don’t have a need to value anything. Or maybe it is the ubiquitous amounts of sex and pleasure seeking that is causing a mindset of ethical incontinence. Or maybe it is the personal shame and regret that causes self-defeating behavior.
Or maybe the whole model of porn is messed up and the cardinal vice is that porn attempts to substitute real sex and loving relationships for fantasy representation. The manner in which the Industry markets their product is done in manner that emphasizes distribution volume instead of content quality. This promotes compulsive consumer behavior which reinforces the emphasis on distribution while at the same time lowering value and encouraging piracy. Not to mention that it could promote social externalities by which porn-induced erectile dysfunction and consumer social withdrawal are becoming more common.
Porn never used to be always like this. In the Golden Age (the late 70s and early 80s) content value was always a top priority (as it was necessary to assuage obscenity prosecutors). Parodies attempt to increase value but they are done in a haphazard way. Many other studios emphasize quality as well. Studios like Juicy Pink Box, Playgirl, Wicked, Vivid, Girlfriend Films, and Elegant Angel…
I guess this is why I will continue to support porn and fight against the broad-based impact of government regulation. There is always one studio out there that is doing things the right way. And with the massive decentralization of the Industry that has occurred with the internet, defending one studio can make a difference.
A dollar to anyone who can actually make heads and tails of just what the ef origen is even saying in the above statement where he says Jilted makes a good point. Is he saying that performers are guaranteed STD’s and it’s theirs and the producers own fault? Does he somehow think the performers HAVE A CHOICE IN THE MATTER? Seriously, people? Please read what he has written in it’s entirety and if you can figure it out AND it makes sense, call me and explain it to me, okay? Thanks!
“Is he saying that performers are guaranteed STD’s and it’s theirs and the producers own fault? ”
Fuck no. *facepalm*
I’m saying that there are responsible producers and performers out there and they should not be forced to use condoms if they don’t want to. BrookeTyler chooses to use condoms with her company. Someone else should have the choice not to use condoms with theirs.
And if you don’t think there’s always a choice what’s the deal with your “talent doesn’t need the companies” comment?
You did not answer her question. You do not answer mine. Let me try it this way. Disease in the adult film industry is RAMPANT. Only an idiot WANTS to have unprotected sex with a complete stranger! Stop making it seem like they all know each other and live in a commune and they just love bareback sex with each other!!!! Downright laughable!!!!! They meet minutes before the scene, show each other their tests, and if the girls get testy because of something they don’t like they get labelled as “hard to work with” on that awful pornstarperformance website which intentionally blackballs performers without restriction!!! Thank you, Stoney, for that one!
Luckily for the outside world, I will show them the truth behind your outright lies and circular writing (yes, it is circular, meaning someone without a grasp on english might think it’s supposed to mean something but it contradicts itself repeatedly) and all you can do is call me names and try to discredit an AVN Hall of Fame Member. Something the other talent should consider when they read the outright disrespect you show for me for saying my piece.
Thank you.
Can some one find out why FSC well not disclose campaign finance disclosures??? Why are they so scared about share them with the world?? Could be industry might find out that what FSC spent it supports money not on was supposed on safe gaurding them but on them selfs?? Indusrty might not like fact that FSC pay huge amount money James Lee which prove be expensive bad idea. May be FSC does want explan amount money there going lose when go court waste there time money sueing La county over condom law. When FSC lose court case there gone be very shake ground with state that when over. May be porn indusrty would be real mad amount about money FSC took from Manwin to buy them off to do there bidding. What ever case may be it does make FSC look good with supports people in indusrty that want know why FSC hide campaign finance disclosures.
I think you mean organizational expenditures not campaign finance disclosures, richard.
Wow now your blame porn performers and producers origen for FSC failures. Same person said here that was responsible FSC safe gaurd porn performers industry. Now your blame them for reckless thing FSC has done on there behalf. Does any one need any more proof that FSC does take responsible for it actions. My advice you stop make stupid excuses origen for FSC becuase now your hurt your cause on matter. Origen I had asked you many questions and you have avoid them all even last one. You spun some very color full bull shit that would give me good enough reason support FSC.
FSC reminds me of Shelley Lubben. Both groups say they support the porn industry to make it safer for the performers and yet it appears only the FSC and Lubben are making out well off the industry, and use smoke and mirrors to explain how they are so well paid.
I make no excuses for the FSC but they are not the boogeymen you are making them out to be. Yes, I think many producers and performers bear the brunt of the blame. Producers like TT Boy and Brian Pumper, performers like Mr. Marcus or Marc Wallice or the tons women who escort. I will say that the FSC’s behavior at the Cal-OHSA meetings last year were atrocious and that the organization needs new leadership.
I well agree with FSC not boogeymen origen but in same breath as I say that they have been living up all thing they promise industry it,s performers they would be of later. I well go far say I agree with you FSC leardship has go. But I am realized and watch governing board of FSC vote Diane Dukes her freinds right back in charge FSC larg pay raise to. So with that it prove me with out doubt that FSC fully being behind her actions thought she did good job as her leadership fail industry performers in it. As she remain head FSC they keep allow her fail them I see no hope FSC stoping Ahf. You can hate dislike Weinstein all like done far better job than Diane has pushing his agenda through getting results for Afh.
Here issue origen FSC claim for years that industry put measures in place that police the action of performers and producers. Yet when those measure fail stop some one like Mr. Marcus or other people you talk about they Make FSC porn indusrty look like bunch liers. With Diane Dukes supporting Mr. Marcus over what he did not state what they do if happen again if any try what MR. Marcus did does make strong argument for FSC that indusrty doing good job at all stoping this events.
I agree richard. Let’s put this to rest. I’m not an FSC member and you and I both criticize the organization. It’s just that the adult industry needs some help defending itself from these regulatory zealots.
To be fair, Origen01 does, at times, makes some valid points. He obviously supports the free speech rights of porn producers, but he is not blind to the plight of performers. He knows the std situation is bery bad, to say the least, he just disagrees with the things that are being done about it. He has many times called for performers to form a union, and the cornerstone of any union is health, safety, and wages, which incidently are the same reasons that producers will fight any performer union to the bitter end. But I think Origen is missing the point of what is happening now. Now there is a LAW on the books, and a statewide law is soon to follow. These are the first steps to that union Origen01, and I thought that you would have seen this. IF, and thats a big if, the industry(FSC&producers) were in favor of a performer union they would have done it years, decades ago.
There is one more reason some people are up in arms about this whole condom issue and here it is…
A whole host of producers, directors, camerapeople, bloggers, hangers on, all try to have sex with the girls (and guys too) and here’s the kicker!!!! If they have an AIM test, the girls might consider doing them bareback!!!! Once condoms are the norm, they can say goodbye to the bareback prostitution sessions AND THEY KNOW IT!!!
[LINK Deleted ... I understand your point but you can make it without linking to that or any other site owned by donny TY]
Try it yourself! Here’s the link to the “AIM database” which has a search bar. Type in the name of anybody you suspect MIGHT want to have unprotected sex with the talent but is not, and would never be, talent!!!! Tony Tedeschi and myself have already started a game naming who shouldn’t be there but is!!!! We have over twenty names so far!!! Maybe we’ll post them when we can’t think of any more!!!
Nick, your posting of that link, and your encouraging of others to use it is way out of line. I appreciate that you have supported some of my comments here but this is just plain wrong on so many levels. We all make mistakes, and you just made a big one, in my humble opinion.
Jilted? I can actually bite a lot harder. I have been insulted by the adult film companies response to condoms since they had the CAL/OSHA meeting. I have in fact bit my tongue immensely when it comes to this subject, believe me. If they had aquiesced, I would have stayed silent. Their response has infuriated me beyond belief and the things I know after twenty something years in this business are incontrovertable! Keep it up and keep fighting worker safety issues and see how much harder I can in fact bite.
I love the people who act in porn because I am one of them! I am no longer in the grip of the porn industry and nobody can silence me! I am doing what I can to be heard and this behavior WILL NOT STOP until people respect the performers and STOP making them fuck to the death! They are NOT gladiators! They are not slaves! They will not continue to believe “we are rebels” bullshit rhetoric.
Again, in case you didn’t get it… I love porn. I hate condoms (but it’s a job, and I hate hardhats too). I love the performers. I used to love the companies that hired me until they decided to throw performers under the bus(and the performers will realize this when they read this). Now, I expect that outsiders such as legislators are in fact reading this and are judging how they will respond to legislation to prevent porn producers from subjecting their employees to disease simply for profits sake!
In other words, to all of you who want bareback porn to continue, and ef you,,,,,,,, checkmate!
The three of you need to get a room…
I think The FSC and porn in general could learn a lot form the conversation here, though heated at times it mostly has been respectful discourse…a good thing and a credit to yall.
Once there was a way to get back homeward.
Once there was a way to get back home.
How?
CAL/OSHA: Please start using condoms?
FSC: Okay, we will implement that policy effective immediately.Period.
That response would have bought the adult film companies a valuable asset in this particular case…. TIME!!!!
And to anyone who thinks that CAL/OSHA would not have been satisfied with that response needs to reexamine the financial burden CAL/OSHA is actually under.
Sorry about posting the link, Mike! I didn’t mean any offense except to expose a cavity that hasn’t been explored yet! Since your site is the one legislators will ask their assistants to examine, I…
I am your biggest fan!!!! I apologize and hope whole heartedly that you will forgive me? Please?
Nick East your totally right on CAL/OSHA vs FSC issue. If Diane Dukes had not attend ever CAL/OSHA meeting scream out same lie ever time about how well industry goes great length safe gaurding performers with out use condoms they might have had better relationship slow thing down. How ever Diane Dukes did what she did when Mr. Marcus event happen it very much nail last nail in coffen of Diane Dukes argument which damge any trust CAL/OSHA had in FSC porn indusrty on making indusrty safer for performers buy them selfs. Way FSC handle MR. Marcus syphilis-infection scandal was so badly handle buy them gave CAL/OSH no right beleave that FSC could handle any kind of STD event again if happen on there watch again. Voters in Los Angeles agree with there vote on matter. FSC want know how hard is repeal law voter have vote in need realize that those who have try take motor cycle helemt law seatbelt law even cell phone law off books in California have all fail in high court in land California supreme court..